The perfect storm is coming – Commercial Real Estate Crash

Mike: Welcome to the FlipNerd.com podcast. This is your host, Mike Hambright. And on this show, I will introduce you to VIPs in the real estate investing industry, as well as other interesting entrepreneurs whose stories and experiences can help you take your business to the next level. We have three new shows each week, which are available in the iTunes store or by visiting FlipNerd.com. So without further ado, let’s get started.
Hey, it’s Mike Hambright from FlipNerd.com. Welcome back for another exciting VIP interview where I interview some of the most successful real estate investing experts and entrepreneurs in our industry to help you learn and grow. Today I am joined by Sal Buscemi who’s a managing partner of Dandrew Partners. It’s a boutique private equity firm that focuses on commercial properties between $3 and $30 million. We really haven’t had a lot of guests talk about commercial properties so today is exciting.
We are going to talk today about how to think like a bank and prepare for the upcoming perfect storm to invest in commercial properties that Sal says is going to make sub-prime look like Sunday school. So with a hook like that, you’ve got to stick around and listen. Before we get started with Sal though, let’s take a moment to recognize our featured sponsors.

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Please note, the views and opinions expressed by the individuals in this program do not necessarily reflect those of FlipNerd.com or any of its partners, advertisers or affiliates. Please consult professionals before making any investment or tax decisions as real estate investing can be risky.

Hey, Sal, welcome to the show.

Sal: Hey, Mike, thanks for having me, I appreciate it.

Mike: I’m glad to have you on. I mentioned a minute ago that to you that a lot of folks, that because our name is FlipNerd they assume, we don’t talk about commercial or we don’t talk about multi-family. Of course we’ve had a number of multi-family guests on but I’d say, the reality is we are in the real estate investing space and talk about a little bit of everything. You are not the first person to tell me that there is a big shoe to drop with commercial real estate so I am excited to learn your perspective on it today.

Sal: I’m surprised you let me talk about the “c” word here on FlipNerd – commercial. Not a lot of people allow me to talk about that but I’m flattered.

Mike: I am glad you are here. Before we get started, though, for folks who don’t know you, before we start talking about the topic of the day, why don’t you introduce yourself. You’re an author, you’ve got a ton of experience on Wall Street.

Sal: Yeah. Let me get into that. It’s actually a pretty interesting story. I know a lot of people listening to this probably watched or listened to a lot of the Rich Dad books and they talk about going to school and getting a good job and then all that kind of stuff.

Mike: Right.

Sal: I actually did that. I went to some of the top colleges in the Northeast, got a job as an investment banker on Wall Street and really learned commercial real estate investing from some of the best and brightest people on Wall Street.
At age 27 I leveraged that. We call that “experience”, or – here’s a cocktail term – “intellectual capital”. I leveraged what I learned and my networks to start my first $30 million fund and we were buying a lot of non-performing notes from banks like Bear Sterns and smaller community banks. That was in 2007 when subprime was almost about ready to hit but not really.

Mike: Yeah.

Sal: Fast-forward to today, I’m involved in some other things. I know you and I have talked about that offline, the defaulted hard money fund, we were buying a lot of these hard money funds in receivership. We have an office in Las Vegas that focuses on that. As we’ve wound that down we see another opportunity now. This is really, truly the opportunity that you and I were laughing about, which is going to make subprime look like Sunday school, and that is the commercial defaults that are going to hit.
A lot of these loans were made in 2005, 2006, all the way up until 2009. What happened is that these loans are coming due. A lot of them have 10-year terms on them and have no hope of getting refinanced, to the tune of about $1.4 trillion, and most of them are upside down. You’re going to see a lot of this actually really paralyze a lot of lenders. It’s going to force a lot more of these [inaudible 00:04:56] and banks that we have left in the United States to consolidate or to close up shop because, let’s face it, a $10,000 check to you and I is a lot more meaningful than it is to someone like Warren Buffett. So when you have these smaller community banks, you’re going to see that they’re going to be looking to get rid of this stuff very quickly.
Oddly enough, even if the loans are performing, a lot of these smaller lenders are under pressure from the FDIC to move a lot of these assets. Really what we want to look at is that we are what we call a debt and equity capital provider. We don’t buy anything. We fund a lot of things and our clients are two people, mostly like what you would see in residential, only it’s the same thing in commercial. People who have found something interesting to buy and they don’t have all the money they need, they come to us.
Or what we’re seeing now, about 60% of our business are people who’ve been asked by their banks to pay their note back at a discount. We don’t use the word “commercial short sale”, but I think that has a connotation which many of your listeners can understand that, yeah, there’s going to be a lot of commercial short sales going on.
As grown-ups, though, grown-up men and women in the industry call it a “discounted pay off”. You’re going to see a lot of opportunity here that a lot of people haven’t seen in a generation since the old days of the RDC. So I’m very excited about that. We’ve been very busy preparing for this.

Mike: Yeah, so why don’t you talk a little bit about the banking side of that, because I know we said that we were going to think like a bank. I know for a fact, there’s some banks that I deal with that several years back, they had loans that were performing. There wasn’t a performance problem but they had some ratios that were out of guideline with the Fed and they were forced to call these notes, sell them, to do whatever they had to do to get rid of them. They kind of rebalanced their portfolio, even though they were performing, which to guys like – maybe not like you – but to me and a lot of other friends of mine, it’s like why would you care about anything other than a performing note?

Sal: Well, if you’ve ever read through the language of a commercial loan, they make it so that you’re always at any given point in violation of the loan covenants. So they can actually foreclose on that at any given time without giving you prior notice. They can say, “Mike, you’re a nice guy.” They’ll wine you, dine you, send you Christmas cards, but before you know it, you’ll be off the Christmas card list the following year and they’ll be calling the loan due.
Here’s why I think it’s important, and this is where a lot of investors get wiped out. It is much easier to be a capital provider because you can make money a couple ways rather than just owning something. If you think about it, I’ve traveled throughout the United States, I’ve been to cities where I was born and raised, in New York where the tallest buildings in every city, even small cities such as Silverton, Colorado, they all have the name of a bank on them, not a landlord. So you’ve got to think about that.
You have to think like a bank and what I’m urging people to do is to get aligned and get trained so that you can actually understand what institutional capital providers like us are looking for, because this is how real [inaudible 00:07:57] in times of chaos. But you also have to know how to structure these deals so that you benefit from this too as well. It is possible to have a multimillionaire dollar IRA by holding what we call “equity stakes” or in the industry “hope certificates” – that’s one of those sexy cocktail terms that us institutions use where somebody . . . think about it as a rehab.
If you give someone money to rehab, use our money for example as a rehab, and they buy a house. It’s a junker for $20,000, they sell it for $100,000. Wouldn’t you want a piece of that equity after they sell it or refinance? That’s what’s happening in commercial.
Commercial, too, it is where the grown men and women hang out. There’s no [inaudible 00:08:37] or RESPA to protect the homeowners or anything. There’s really no political gain by protecting the fat cats type of people who are the people who are facing foreclosure in commercial real estate. It just doesn’t make sense. That’s where the opportunities are today.

Mike: Yeah. Great, great. Well, tell us a little bit about . . . I don’t want to steal your thunder. I’m already thinking there’s a lot of people who listen to our show that have all sorts of, I mean, we’re blessed to have a lot of people that listen to this show and watch the show, so a little bit of every sort of background. But for guys like me that have primarily invested in single-family houses for a long time, and I understand that there’s an opportunity coming, there’s some guys like me that have been investing in single-family homes for a long time and you love the idea of being able to apply larger amounts of capital and do larger investments, kind of to your point of that’s where the big boys hang out is there’s a lot of drama that goes away with that.
But how do you transition or how do you kind of make your way to position yourself to this opportunity that’s coming?

Sal: A lot of the people that work with us, we call them intermediaries. These are people who still have very successful residential real estate flipping wholesaling business. In the industry we call it “crossing the trade”, you’re crossing trades. That is something that you never want to [inaudible 00:10:01] off because that’s paying you today. But if you’re in the business, you’re naturally going to be finding opportunities just because you’re in the business. Somebody’s going to come up by you and you’re going to see an opportunity underneath your nose. So you need to be able to look at this.
If it’s alright, I’d like to qualify this. The deals where your listeners are going to be very competitive are going to be between what we call 3 and 30 million [inaudible 00:10:23], just a smaller balance commercial. If you start seeing the Empire State Building or the Brooklyn Bridge for sale [inaudible 00:10:29], chances are that’s not really a good deal. So you’re looking at the smaller community type [inaudible 00:10:36] we’re going to be unloading this stuff. That is how you’re going to be able to qualify whether or not that this is a real deal or not. That’s where a lot of people are going to be competitive.
I just want to reiterate that – between $3 and $30 million. I would just say look through your inbox, see what you’ve got and [inaudible 00:10:52] how to be able to qualify these deals in 90-seconds or less. Is that okay?

Mike: Yeah, absolutely.

Sal: Let’s get with this. Let’s just say you’re combing through your inbox and you know there’s a commercial deal or somebody, broker or realtor, title agent, somebody has brought to you an opportunity and they don’t know what to do with it. I don’t know how to do everything in life but I know people who are smarter than I am and that’s basically how I deliver that to my success.
If you look at it this way, the most important way that you want to do this is look at five data points. A lot of times brokers will send to you these huge 22-megabyte PDF attachments that are just loaded with stuff that doesn’t matter. It’s useless. What they’re trying to do is trying to confuse you to convince you to buy. A lot of people have gotten hurt doing that.
What you want to do is you want to look at five data points. Number one, the current NOI. This is what the asset is throwing off today – the net operating income. That is the driver of value for the property today. Not what it will be, not what it was 20 years ago, but what it is today.
The second one is the pro-forma [inaudible 00:12:01]. One of my colleagues on the Street here, [inaudible 00:12:05] you don’t have to worry about it being a lie because it is a lie, but at least it’ll tell us exactly where the borrower’s trying to get to.
Number three, the debt structure, the debt stack. How much debt is on here? These five data points are going to help us to determine how we’re going to engineer a solution to this deal. We want to know how much debt is there. Sometimes these properties, you’re going to find about 50% of them are going to be overleveraged. This is not news to anybody on this call, but for some brokers and other people who are not in the know who really aren’t trying to think like an investor, this is [inaudible 00:12:42].

Mike: Right.

Sal: Number four, I want to know what the sources and uses are. If we provide capital to someone, what are they going to be using that money for? We’ll put in a spreadsheet sources, Sal, uses by apartment complex. Well, that doesn’t really make sense. When you move into an apartment complex, you automatically assume that there’s going to be a roof and light bulbs and toilet, right? That’s not value added improvements.
But what people do not expect to have are perhaps 2.5 horsepower whirlpool tubs for mothers to relax in. That’s a value added. That’ll get people migrating across the street to a new apartment complex in a short period of time. A newly paved parking lot, nice landscaping, perhaps a part-time [inaudible 00:13:31], that’s important, so number four is the sources and uses.
Number five, the last is the [inaudible 00:13:39] strategy. If we’re a short term lender, we’re not someone who’s going to be making 30, 40-year loans, our max term is 3 years. We’re like a private bridge hard money lender. How are you and I going to be taken out of this deal with a borrower. Does he have a plan? There’s only two exit doors when there’s a fire in the movie theater. It’s sell or refinance and right now both are [00:14:03] pretty high.
There was a point there when the banks were not lending as much as they were so you’re [inaudible 00:14:10] with a sale but now we’ve got to figure out, what are they going to do? Are they going to sell or are they going to [inaudible 00:14:16]?

Mike: Hey, Sal, why don’t you clarify, let’s talk about different property classes or property types in terms of the opportunity that’s coming and maybe even in terms of what you guys invest in or what you advise people to focus on or stay away from or I’m not actually sure what you’re criteria are but you do multi-family, office buildings, car washes . . .

Sal: We do the four food groups. Yeah, well, ask me about that in a second. There’s an environmental risk with that. But we like the four food groups. The four food groups are this: multi-family, retail, office and warehouse. Let me say that again. Multi-family, office, retail and industrial warehouse.
What you’re starting to see a lot of things get hot right now is multi-family. I think multi-family has been sort of overbought. I think if I was owning multi-family right now I would be a seller of multi-family. I think the opportunities today you’re going to see are going to be in the mixed use warehouse. Companies like Amazon are buying up all sorts of warehouses throughout the country so they can improve their delivery systems and mechanisms.
I also see a lot of opportunity too in the [inaudible 00:15:32] retail. Not all the retail. Specifically grocery anchored, pharma anchored, types of Wal-Marts, smaller town type of stores – they call them ALCOAs – Dollar General, general stores, these basic staples.
Then lastly what I like is probably something that you’re going to see a lot more of is hospitality starting to come back a little bit. That’s going to be some interesting stuff, most notably the smaller type of things. As consumers spending comes back, people are going to start to go on vacation, have fun. The small, flat [inaudible 00:16:12] Marriott or Residence Inn or something like that, these smaller types of [inaudible 00:16:20] hotels are, I think, going to be the next big thing.
I think things I would advise would be huge retailers like Sears or J.C. Penney. I think they’re death knell right now. Sears is going to be getting rid of a lot of real estate but that’s opportunity. Office too, [inaudible 00:16:35] is coming under a lot of pressure because a lot of people are working from home; they’re telecommuting now. There’s no need to go into a big office building to do that. I would stay away from [inaudible 00:16:44] too as well because it’s just some of these doctors are having a hard time making ends meet and that could put pressure on cash flows before.

Mike: Yeah, so when you talk about things like warehouse, I know you mentioned Amazon’s buying up space, but with a lot of warehouse space, my gut tells me you either are doing terrible or you’re doing well because you probably have one tenant usually, right? So either you’ve got them or you don’t. Is that how you look at it? Are you looking for stuff that’s currently performing only?

Sal: Well, that’s a very good question. One of the things that we want to stay away from right now, which I think was overbuilt, was the proverbial self-storage. There was a lot of self-storage that was a gateway drug to people wanting to become a developer. You were a fun-loving dentist or accountant and you wanted to take a risk, you’d invest in some land and you’d buy some steel and cement and build a self-storage. Overbuilt.
That’s a little different now. When you look at the warehouses, you look at the industrial, you have to make sure that you have a good strong corporate tenant behind you who’s going to lease this out. Recently we wrote a term sheet for a corporate tenant that was actually putting something together, storage for a big pharmaceutical company. This is something that was just found in the middle of nowhere in Arizona, but they wanted to make sure that they had a good temperature-controlled [inaudible 00:18:07] environment for them to warehouse their drugs or whatever it is that they were doing. They had a huge 15-year commitment on something that they built and it worked out very well.
A lot of these, too, have been turned into data centers. That’s a little more expensive to build because you have to put in cooling systems and all that type of stuff, but you’re starting to see those things pop up too as well.
The old staples, people want to get started and they want a portfolio of cash-building income, if they have the stomach for it, mobile home parks are always the way to go. If people want to buy [inaudible 00:18:40] on account, you can always buy these on terms because banks don’t like lending on them. I think [inaudible 00:18:45] family’s gotten a little toppy right now. Not to say you can’t find some good areas because real estate, especially in this industry, creates both winners and losers and it depends on which side you’re on.
Think about it. Somebody’s running their multi-family to the ground because they live in California [inaudible 00:19:03] in Texas, good story, by the way. They bought it at the equivalent of a two cap and what happened was because they wanted money they fired the management company. It used to be 97% leased. Now it’s 68% leased. The Indians who took over the Reservation and so that’s an opportunity there for buying something at a discount and turning it around.

Mike: Yeah. Let’s get into the weeds a little bit and talk about how people who want to maybe pursue and get active in this space and maybe don’t have deals come across their plate right now in the commercial space. What are some of the things that they should be looking for, and I guess maybe give some context to the reality is there’s probably a lot of people listening to this show that are primarily single-family investors and a lot of them are one-man bands or smaller organizations where they’re probably not used to doing partnerships as much as what’s common in commercial, obviously. Talk about kind of the pieces of the team that you need to put together kind of a team of people to kind of pursue this, pursue commercial opportunities.

Sal: I think what you have to do is you just have to know what to look for. Number one, you have to understand what to look for and actually beyond a shadow of a doubt really understand if you have something that’s an opportunity or not. That’s number one.
Number two is look underneath your nose but ask around. Talk to people and say, “Hey, are you seeing any commercial foreclosures? Are you seeing any stress?” Where we like to target, maybe some people might not appreciate this but where we like to target people who have a lot of commercial distress are usually out of state owned because they’ve bought something, they don’t know how to manage it and they’ve run it into the ground. Number two, hard money lenders, because they haven’t been taken out.
I know where you are in Texas, [inaudible 00:20:54], Texas, there’s a lot of hard money lenders and a lot of them are competitive. What they’re doing is making loans for more than they should to get involved in these assets. What you need to do, once you understand that, you need to make sure that you have good, strong, dedicated capital partner on your side.
Now, I’m not the only guy in town doing this stuff. There’s many other people but you need to know how to present these deals because the whole premise of wealth creation and commercial real estate is not you knocking tin and painting doors and doing all the hard work. It’s having somebody else do that but you get a piece of the profit participation by bridging the capital, which is us, to somebody else who’s a borrower or operator. Does that make sense?

Mike: Yeah.

Sal: This way you’re able to leverage your time better, you don’t have to go out there and worry about drawn out short sales, all sorts of [inaudible 00:21:45] drama that comes with closure and people in foreclosure. You’re dealing with grown up women and men who are professionals who really want to put deals together because they have an alignment of interests with you to make sure that you these deals are good, that these deals close, because that’s how they get paid.

Mike: I see. Okay. All right. Why don’t you take a minute or two and just kind of share what you think the . . . if the commercial market has a big fallout like you expect, and a lot of people do, what are the implications that will have on the rest of the economy, at a high level? Single-family, what are the implications?

Sal: I can get into . . . yeah. Banks aren’t lending right now. Even Ben Bernanke, our esteemed Federal Fed Chairman couldn’t get a loan. If commercial really does drop the way we expect it to, banks are going to be paralyzed. They’re not going to be able to lend and they’re not going to be making loans anyway. They’re not making loans right now because they’re licking their wounds and they only want to work with the top borrowers to be able to do this, so you have to be qualified socially, financially. It’s almost ridiculous what you have to go through in order to get a loan today.

Mike: When you say “to get a loan”, are you talking about for commercial deals?

Sal: No, no, no. For residential. For commercial, it’s even more difficult today too as well because they want you to bring a lot more money to the table. Private capital providers, hedge funds like ours, are going to be the ones who are providing capital during all this chaos, and that’s really what it is. If banks start getting in trouble because they have a lot of non-performing loans, they’re going to stop making loans. If they’re not making loans already, they’re definitely not going to be making loans and that’s going to have negative implications for a lot of things, especially in an American economy where a lot of people are dependent upon using their homes as a piggy bank with the old HELOC loans and refinancing every six months.
There are people in California who I think didn’t really work during the early 2000’s. They just kept refinancing their homes over and over again. And they could because they were making $500,000 every year in home equity, perceived market equity. That’s where I think it is. Unfortunately that’s going to have a ripple effect for realtors and mortgage brokers and people who are connected to the financed-based society or economy where people are living off of the success of the real estate market.

Mike: Yeah.

Sal: That’s what I think.

Mike: Yeah, yeah. The great thing is, as you and I both know, where there’s smoke and fire, there’s opportunity. Even the residential market, I’ve said it a number of times, probably people may be tired of hearing it from me but, man, I’d love to have 2008, 2009 back in the residential market because we were tearing it up.

Sal: I’d bet my whole career on this, Mike. Either that or I’m going to be working at Wal-Mart pretty soon. That’s really what it comes down to and you will see that. You will see [inaudible 00:24:53]. To get a little deeper on this, I don’t think people really want me to go that deep into it but you have to think about it, though. There’s been no increases in wages, right? Wages have been stagnated, taxes have gone up, inflation’s gone up and people have less than 1% interest on savings. So it’s only natural that you’re going to see people that gravitate towards housing [inaudible 00:25:16] up again and then pretty soon the music will stop and everything will drop.
I think you’re going to start to see a lot of pain happening, especially now after the last election in November that happened this past November. I think you’re going to start to see where banks are just have to start getting rid of stuff at deep, deep discounts and you’d better be aligned with someone who has capital in the pockets to be able to pull these deals off. A smart set of eyes, smart money to be able to really understand how to be able to structure these deals with your interests at heart because anybody can see an opportunity, but funding it is 90% of the problems.

Mike: Yeah. Sal, tell me about . . . there’s a number of banks that I work with here, actually, on residential stuff, but there are smaller community banks typically about how to start building relationships with those guys to let them know that if and when the time comes, I might be interested.

Sal: Let me just give you that hot script right here. It’s probably perfect and if you want to transcribe this and send it out to your family, I’m fine with that. What you want to do is you want to be able to [inaudible 00:26:26] in mind banks that have less than $2 billion under management, under $2 billion, with a “B”, under assets, under $2 billion. And you want to be able to call the Chief Credit Officer or you want to call someone who’s in charge of their loan portfolios. Bigger banks have different names for them. They call them “Chief [inaudible 00:26:47] Officers”, whatever.
Stay away from the Bank of America. Stay away from J.P. Morgan and [inaudible 00:26:51]. The Federal Reserve takes care of their own. These guys don’t need you. They’re not going to be selling stuff from you. Nobody really cares if you have a relationship with Bank of America. They’re not really the most esteemed institution in this country.
I will tell you that what you want to do, you want to call these folks and say, “Hey, my name is Mike. I’m calling from Mike Company Investments LLC. We’re based in Dallas, and I’m just wondering if you have anything on your balance sheet that you want to clear.” Right then and there they’re going to say, “Hmm, this is very interesting.”
There is an FDIC infographic I put together that shows this and I’ll share it with you, Mike, if you want to disseminate that to your group. This is something where it’s a step by step. You don’t go to the FDIC.gov because there’s no search engine there. You have to go to a secret link. They make it difficult. Like any other government institution, it’s never easy. It’s sort of like going to the DMV, but once you know what to look for, you’ve hit the Promised Land.
This is what our folks do all the time but only on a national basis. But some of you guys have relationships with people who work at banks. LinkedIn is a very, very powerful resource to use. If you combine using LinkedIn and with the FDIC infographic, you’re going to find that you’re going to be able to get involved in a lot of relationship banks that are not only going to help you with your flipping business, wholesaling business, or short sale business, but it’s going to really open up the minds. Now you’re going to be able to find an opportunity in commercial and be able to bring that to capital providers like us.
Is this good?

Mike: Yeah.

Sal: Does this make sense?

Mike: Yeah, yeah.

Sal: Again, you’re the Larry King and I’m just talking here.

Mike: Well, at least I’m not Oprah. Awesome. Well, hey, Sal, I know you’re an author and you’ve got some books out. There’s one in particular that we were talking about before, The Art of the Raise. Why don’t you tell us a little bit about that and how folks . . . I know that you’ve got kind of the ability for people to get an advanced copy right now. We’ll add a link down below but why don’t you tell us about that book.

Sal: Absolutely. We put this book together. This is my second book that’s going to be talking about how real estate funds are really structured. Funds are one of those cocktail terms where everybody likes to throw it around but nobody has a clue as to what it means. So we’re going to be talking about how, really, funds like ours work. We’ve really pulled back the layers of the onion here and the reason for that is because if you understand what your money looks for and what the needs are and how they’re structured, it’s going to be great.
Plus I’m going to go out on a limb and I’m going to challenge everybody who’s listening to this that they should really think about their own funds at some point in their career as a real estate investor. If you have a dedicated pocket of capital, you’re going to be a lot more profitable, you’re going to be a lot more aggressive and competitive to be able to go out there and get the deals.

Mike: Absolutely.

Sal: It’s easier today than ever before. I’m going to say something very controversial. That is it’s easier today to raise money, than it is to actually get it out the door. Can you believe that, Michael?

Mike: No doubt about it.

Sal: You have the past 12 years, 13 years [inaudible 00:29:59] 1% interest rates. To this money manager, there’s no catalyst for rates to increase. [inaudible 00:30:05] desperate for yield and they want anything they can in order to get some sort of semblance of somebody they know who they can get on the phone and say, “Hey, I’ve got some money. We’re [inaudible 00:30:15]. What are we doing with the money that I gave you?” If they want more intimate management of their money into someone who understands how to use real estate.

Mike: Yeah.

Sal: That’s my passion right there is the fund management business. I love it. There’s an advanced copy that we’re offering to people and I think I sent you the link to this. It’s a special link for your group. But this is going to give them in 29, 30 pages really what they need to know and it’s going to make them actually smarter than 95% of the people in the industry.

Mike: That’s awesome.

Sal: I think it’s neat. It’s going to let people understand exactly what it is, how these funds work and how they should start talking to people because, believe it or not, if anyone’s on here, I firmly believe that they’ve gained the notoriety at this point, just like what we’re talking about with you a couple days ago before this call is that you gain a little notoriety as a real estate investor and guess what? People want to invest alongside you and they have money.
The one thing that freaks people out is what if I lose it, where do they write the check to. This book will take care of all of it and it’s free for your listeners.

Mike: That’s great. That’s great. I look forward to reading it myself. Well, hey, Sal, thanks for joining us today. Definitely appreciate your insights and I think for those that are listening, if you haven’t been through a different cycle before, it creates tremendous opportunities for sure. Don’t let what Sal said here scare you. Start thinking about how to position yourself to take advantage of the opportunity because it’s going to be real.
Even aside from this, there’s booms and busts so that’s what real estate in America is all about is cycles to ride out. Thanks so much, Sal, for spending your time with us today.

Sal: Thank you, Mike, for letting me talk. Thank you.

Mike: Yeah, yeah, and we’ll add a link down below the video here for those that are interested in getting an advanced copy of The Art of the Raise. Thanks, Sal.

Sal: Thank you, Michael. Take care.

Mike: All right. Have a great day.
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