Virtual Investing Empire – 3 States and No Office

Mike: This is the flipnerd.com Expert Real Estate Investing Show, the show for real estate investors, whether you’re a veteran or brand-new. I’m your host, Mike Hambright, and each week I bring you a new expert guest that will share their knowledge and lessons with you. If you’re excited about real estate investing, believe in personal responsibility, and taking control of your life and financial destiny, you’re in the right place.

This is episode number 340 and my guests today are my friends Lee Bryant and Jessica Weaver that operate a virtual real estate investing empire, where they’re doing about 125 deals a year, mostly rehabs, across three states with just a few employees. They’re an impressive duo that shares a lot today on the show. In fact, Lee and Jessica work together but even they live in different states.

Today they share why they invest in so many different markets, how they use virtual systems to do much of the work and they provide advice for those looking to either get started or to expand. This episode is full of some great knowledge and you just don’t want to miss it. Please help me welcome Lee and Jessica to the show.

Hey, guys, welcome to the show.

Lee: Hey.

Jessica: Hey.

Mike: Good to see you.

Lee: Good to see you.

Mike: For those who are listening in, Lee and Jessica and I are in a Mastermind together. These guys are really awesome. They’re doing a great job. You’re the type of folks that don’t do any info type stuff, you’re just head in the trenches and working hard and making stuff happen, so I’m excited to share you with my listeners because I think you guys are awesome.

Lee: Thanks for having us.

Jessica: We’re excited to be here.

Mike: Yeah. Before we kind of get started talking about how you’ve built your three-state empire virtually, why don’t you maybe tell us a little bit about your backgrounds and how you guys got started?

Lee: Okay. I’m Lee Bryant. I’m out of Savannah, Georgia. When we began I was an Allstate agency, I’d been there for 20 years and I just said, “It’s time to move on.” About 10 years ago I went full-time. I sold my agency and began working together, Jessica and I.

We started off in the beginning doing high-end short sales. We were doing them in Georgia, South Carolina, on the coast. Jessica actually worked for a negotiating company back then for the first year, and then she came to work with me and we began doing the high-end short sales 10 years ago.

Mike: Yeah, so back in, I guess, ’07. I realize it when I start getting older, you’re like decades go by and you’re like, “Oh, has it been that long?” That was ’07. Yeah, so that was right when stuff was starting to hit the proverbial fan, right? Especially in the luxury markets, right? That’s where you guys were primarily operating.

Lee: It was crazy. We were literally getting houses for a third of their value.

Mike: Yeah. Then you kind of evolved to where, I don’t want to steal your thunder yet, but going into additional markets and additional ways to find deals as kind of time went by, right?

Lee: Yeah. We were working Hilton Head, South Carolina, Savannah, Georgia, St. Augustine, Florida. We’re kind of still working in a little big area, but it wasn’t as large as what we do now. But we had to create the volume then. We were still kind of working virtually through several states.

Mike: When you guys first started working together, I know you guys live in different states now. Were you working virtually even at that time? Did you guys start in the same geography?

Jessica: We’ve always been virtual working together. I actually started, I’m in St. Augustine, Florida. I was in real estate and then started working on the short sales and we were working together from two different states that way. And we’ve kind of always stayed that way.

Lee: Yeah, we’ve only had an office one time. We had an office about four or five years ago. We had an office for about a year or two. Obviously she wasn’t there but we did have an office. I like it better the way we do it now.

Jessica: You weren’t really there.

Lee: I’m not an office type person.

Mike: Yeah, I have an office that’s where I’m at now is 1.2 miles from my house, which is nice because the first, I guess, six or seven years I was in business, we were about a half-hour away. So it was nice to get close to home but even now, like this morning even, I went to Starbucks for a couple hours before I came to the office. I prefer not to have to come here. So I get it.

Lee: Yeah, I didn’t like it at all.

Jessica: He really can’t stand to be in an office. He [inaudible 00:04:29].

Mike: When you were with Allstate, though, you were pretty much tied to an office, I bet, right?

Lee: Yeah, but I didn’t work very hard when I was with Allstate. I had an agency and so I was there probably 20 hours a week in it. But yeah, I was in an office quite a bit then.

Mike: So there are a lot of real estate investors that, I guess kind of like me, have primarily operated in one market for most of the time, especially early on. Then there are some other guys out there that are virtual and they usually are operating in one or two markets and they kind of manage that virtually, maybe travel every once in awhile. But you guys have expanded over time to be operating in three states, which is pretty incredible. I know you tend to work in some more rural areas and some smaller towns. Is that kind of the main reason why you had to expand out so far?

Lee: Yeah, as competition grew, we started small, started in Georgia, and then a little bit South Carolina and then as the markets have heated up, we’ve had to expand to keep our volume up. That’s our main reason, but we don’t necessarily just love to go to all these different places. We do it for volume.

Mike: I guess you’ve probably found that smaller markets tend to be less competitive, I guess, than some of the bigger markets? I’m feeling that pressure here in Dallas.

Lee: There’s no comparison. If you deal in some of our markets that you would think are small, they’re very competitive and then we buy houses in some of these places where it’s literally no competition.

Mike: Yeah. I know you guys are doing around maybe 120, 125 houses a year typically. One of the things I think is really amazing about you guys is that you have a really small team, you’re virtual. Even the two of you that are here with us today live in different states. Just talk about how that kind of started, because I know you had to overcome some issues, and then how that’s kind of evolved.

Lee: Yeah. It really evolved because of virtual assistants. That’s really what’s made us where we were. Obviously being in groups such as the one you and I are in, we were able to systematize our businesses in such a way that we can turn that kind of volume because we’re very systematized with it and it allows us to do that.

Mike: Yeah, yeah. When did you start having virtual assistants? There was a time where that was kind of unheard of and then it’s just became popular.

Jessica: Seven years ago, I believe.

Lee: Seven or eight years. Pretty much the whole time that we’ve turned to volume. When we did the short sale business, I don’t think we had any virtual assistants. I don’t remember assistants.

Jessica: No. It started actually with, when we started our HUD stuff.

Lee: Yeah. So we’ve had them seven, eight years and we’ve had very little turnover. We use some out of the Philippines. I think we’ve only had, for our HUD business, I think we’ve only had two in seven years, so it’s not like . . . we have the same person now. We’ve had her for five years.

She got a master’s degree, and we thought she was going to leave. But when she got a master’s degree, she missed a day at work because she was going to graduate. I said, “Well, she’s gone. She was just doing this while she was finishing up her school.” And now she’s still here a couple more years later. Still here.

Jessica: Amazing.

Mike: So talk about your team. You’re in three states and a lot of different markets. You’re doing about 120, 125 deals a year and you’re doing a lot of HUD stuff. You’re doing a lot of REOs still. Even you said you guys are still doing some short sale stuff. I guess some of that is because in those more rural markets, there’s more of that stuff that’s kind of still happening than probably the bigger markets, right?

Lee: Yes. It’s competitive now than what it was even two years ago in the rural markets, but our volume last year was as high as it’s been, so we’ll keep on going. But of course, we’re standing out, and trying to keep the volume up.

Mike: Yeah. Maybe Jessica, you talk about the overall structure of your team, the two of you and I know you have a real small team to make all this happen. What’s the structure like?

Jessica: I oversee, I would say, the business in general. I oversee the virtual assistants.

Mike: Well, we just heard Lee say he doesn’t like to work.

Jessica: No. He complains a lot when he has to work.

Mike: I’m kidding.

Jessica: He turns his phone off at 5 everyday, which is a good thing, I think, to be able to do that. But I basically oversee our acquisitions, our virtual assistants, make sure offers are going in, evaluate all the properties that are coming in from the leads to us, marketing also oversee our marketing.

I’m not really even sure what Lee does but he actually handles all the contractors. He has final say on everything. We have Jackie, who works from home. She is in the States and she is our business manager, I believe is what her title is. She keeps the paperwork, she pays all the bills, she pays all the contractors.

Mike: Is she in the same market as either one of you guys?

Jessica: She’s in Savannah.

Lee: She’s been with me for almost . . . she was with me with Allstate.

Mike: I see.

Jessica: She’s done great. So there’s Jackie and then we have another assistant that just does kind of whatever needs to be done to set up the insurance, take calls if needed if we have overflow calls, stuff like that.

Lee: The secret that . . . the reason we can do the big areas is because we use contractors, we have two traveling crews of contractors, general contractors that travel for us so they’re on the road constantly doing the rehabs. Most markets have a contractor in Savannah, Georgia or wherever it is. That particular market has its own contractor that we’ve had for a long time, so it’s actually fairly easy with that because I don’t have to go visually see these properties because I kind of know what’s going on based on past experiences.

Mike: I want to talk about that a little bit. I’m sorry, go ahead.

Jessica: So if we get a house in Columbus, Georgia, it may be a four or five-hour drive, we can send our contractor there to go ahead and give us the rehab scope of work and our agent there so we don’t have to go there until we buy it.

Lee: Most cities have an agent also at least one agent we can send there and give us our comps to be able to tell us if it’s a deal or not. So even though our team’s small, we utilize our different people.
Mike: Kind of outside partners or vendors or whatever.

Lee: Yeah.

Mike: I know you guys primarily rehab, right?

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I know you guys primarily rehab, right?

Lee: We were about 50% rehab, 50% wholesale. Then about three years ago, I guess, because comps were so good and I hated to see giving up the money, so I started doing a lot more rehabs. So about 80% of them are rehabs now. As hot as it is, we may actually cut that back a little bit because it’s so easy now that . . .

Mike: Yeah. Talk a little bit about this traveling rehab crew. Outside of a couple of the bigger markets, you have a couple crews that’ll just go wherever they need to go across three states?

Lee: It’s fun. They go and they stay in the houses. They’ll stay in the house and so they work 12 hours a day, so they can turn a lot more volume than an average contractor crew because they’re there from 7 in the morning until 7 or 8 at night every day working. So they’re working 12-hour days.

Mike: Wow. So they actually just stay in the house that they’re working on.

Jessica: Yeah. We show up there and they have their air mattresses. They have a grill usually out front or back, wherever they’re grilling. They take a TV. They get the hang of it too and I think some of them like it.

Lee: It’s a win-win for all of us. Like I said, we get houses turned a lot quicker than a normal contractor that’s working from 8 to 4. We get them turned a lot faster.

Mike: Yeah. How did you come up with . . . you’ve got to find the right people that are willing to do that, right?

Lee: If they burn, that’s the reason we have two crews. We’ve just got two crews in the last couple years because we were burning the crew out. But this new crew that we’ve had for about a year, a year and a half, they’ve never gone home. He’s out of Atlanta, Georgia and I don’t know if he’s ever gone back.

Jessica: I’m not sure what that situation is.

Lee: But he’s with us. He’s gone during Christmas. He’s on the road. They were working during Christmas.

Mike: So how big are these crews? Is it just like two or three guys that are kind of doing everything?

Lee: Sometimes it’ll get . . . it depends on what they have going on. They’ll bring in a crew, like a vinyl crew or something and they’ll stay with them for a few days and buy an old house or paint the house, then they’ll leave. They painting crews will come in and stay with them and then they’ll leave. So sometimes there’s six or seven but most of the time it’s like three guys.

Mike: Yeah. That’s an interesting model. I’m curious to hear how that kind of started. You had a contractor and you’re like, “Would you travel . . .” Because I’ve done it before. I sent some guys out to about two hours north on a deal one time and I put them up in a hotel. It turns out that there were some bed bugs or something. It didn’t look like it was a bad hotel but now I’m feeling like a bad guy. It was a small town so there weren’t a lot of hotels.

Jessica: We understand.

Mike: They were like, “No, we’re not doing that again.” Did you kind of ease into just asking somebody, “Would you be willing to go down there and do this house?” and then the next thing you know . . .?

Lee: It all started on like a weekend where I’d send them and they would go stay in a house for, let’s say, a weekend, where they could really go home but why go home and just knock out two days of work?

Jessica: Some were a couple hours away so then they work Friday through Monday. It was a small deal. Then they realized it wasn’t that bad. They do want the AC to work and all that. It can’t be a terrible, terrible house.

Mike: You’re not sticking them in a total burnout or anything.

Lee: The houses are okay. Usually what they’ll do if it is a house that’s pretty rough, they’ll stay in a hotel for a couple days until they can get it . . .

Jessica: Get it cleaned up.

Lee: Get it cleaned up and livable. But it’s funny.

Mike: Yeah. In terms of . . . I want to ask you some questions in a minute about getting started, but in terms of the evolution, you started to go after different lead sources and kind of expanded out geographically. What’s your plan for the future? Is it to continue to expand geographically or where do you go from here? I know it’s a lot of work. I get it.

Lee: No. We’re actually going to try to pull back in and our goal . . . one of the things is doing more wholesale deals. I think that can pull me back in where we don’t have as big of an area, and who knows? Volume comes and goes. We think the volume’s dropping. As soon as we do some things to generate more business, and as soon as we did, that it pops loose and right now it’s probably as slow for the incoming properties to buy as it has been for a year or two. But it always seems to go back up, so that’s where we are right now.

Mike: Yeah. For folks that are just kind of getting started, what kind of advice can you give to people that are getting started that hear . . . I’m always kind of cognizant of having guests on the show . . . I want people to listen and walk away with, “That helped me. I can go do this now,” or whatever. I think sometimes people listen to folks like you and they’re like, “I have this big empire that I can’t even imagine how to get from just starting to doing that,” and I know that you guys didn’t do that either. It evolved over time, right? Why don’t you tell us this, if you had to do over again, what would you do differently?

Lee: I don’t know. It’s been a pretty good roll for us. I probably would have stopped going wider and got in a little deeper in my markets that I was currently in instead of expanding, expanding, expanding. I probably would have stopped it at a point instead of what we’ve done and gone into three states, I probably would have stayed in a state or two and then . . .

Mike: Yeah. I guess some of what you guys are doing with HUD houses and stuff like that, it almost becomes agnostic to where you are or where the houses are because you’re doing all that stuff virtually anyway, right?

Lee: Yeah, it’s all virtual so it kind of depends on what a real estate agent says is a deal or HUD deal we receive. We don’t control that. The only way we control it is by our marketing for other ways of getting properties.

We use real estate agents so we do have some control over that because we can market to real estate agents that we want them to send us deals. So we can put more effort in certain markets with those.

Mike: Yeah. Maybe, Jessica, I know you guys have a realtor program that’s evolved over time where you have boots on the ground to help you buy houses, to look at houses maybe that are HUD houses or whatever, just to be your eyes and ears. But then you’ve kind of evolved to where you found a way to get deals and kind of get more deal flow through agents in a lot of different markets, right?

Jessica: It’s actually been very successful. We started it and it’s all automated. A virtual assistant does it for me on a weekly basis. They’re basically sending an introduction email out to real estate agents and letting them know who we are, what we do, and just saying, “Hey, keep us in mind if you have a deal fall through, and we can buy it quick so give us a shot.”

Then beyond that, we email them and we text them weekly. It’s a very casual communication. It’s very personal. They feel like, Lee actually is texting them directly and it’s just like, “Hey, you got anything for me to look at?” They get to know us and it took a couple months to kick in but then they kind of forget that they don’t actually know you. It works. They’ll text deals to us. They’ll respond back to the emails, “Have you looked at this yet?” whatever.

It’s been very successful for us and if a deal falls through, they have that in their head because we’ve been there just kind of ticking at them every single week. So that’s been a successful program. We really weren’t planning on it to be as successful as it has been.

Lee: I kind of relate it to a guy like yourself versus some of the gurus. They’re out there and as a person watching, you kind of get to know that person and you kind of think you know them. Even if you don’t know them, you kind of think you know them because you’re listening to them and listening to their . . .

Mike: Yeah, you’ve already built up some level of trust, right?

Lee: Yeah, and that’s what goes on with this. These agents, they kind of know me because I’m sending out my texts, which is an automated text, but I’m sending them automated texts each week. So it builds a good relationship.

Jessica: My email’s there too. If they don’t delete it, they can search back through their email and go, “Who was that person who said if a deal fell through . . .” Agents that aren’t on our list have been referred by other agents like, “Oh, you should call so and so.” So referrals kind of trickle on down. It’s good.

Lee: It’s a strong program. We have to cut it back at times. It can be almost overwhelming. You can turn the volume up on it instantly and have more deals coming your way. Now, on all the deals you have to weed through them.

Mike: You’ve got to kiss a bunch of frogs . . .

Lee: You can have more volume than you can really handle.

Jessica: And you won’t be able to respond to everything that’s being sent. I tell my VAs, “Don’t send an email or text this week.” I think it also helps to stop it for a little while. Then when we send it, they’re like, “Oh, yeah . . .” There’s a little space in between the texts and emails, it kind of helps.

Mike: Yeah. I do this training for some of the people I coach and mentor on networking, but I kind of talk about a lot of folks will say, “I met somebody,” or, “I met a realtor,” and I told them if they ever come across a deal, let me know. Everybody, every investor says that to realtors, right? So how do you stand out? One way to stand out is just to keep tapping them on the shoulder like, “Hey, I’m still here.”

It’s just basically kind of a recency thing, right? If you consider that most realtors are the ones that are involved with probably 90-plus percent of the deals in the country, a lot of them are retail deals that aren’t investor-friendly. But every once in awhile they come across something and you want to be top of mind and that’s what you guys are doing is you’re texting them and sending them emails and just making sure that when they come across something, they remember you, right?

Jessica: It’s kind of funny, actually too, because one of our texts is like, “Do you have a deal fall through? Let me know. I can buy your house or something.” That response to those, they’re like, “How did you know?” They think we heard from somebody.

Lee: They think you heard about it because deals are always falling through. So when you send that out, they’ll call you up and say, “Yeah, I did have that.”

Jessica: “Who told you?”

Lee: “How’d you know that?” when it’s just a random text.

Jessica: That’s funny.

Mike: Talk a little bit more about your virtual assistants. I know that you have a great program, Jessica, of getting virtual assistants to be really productive. I have quite a few virtual . . . actually, we have about 15 people on our team from all across the world. Now, they’re not all administrative VAs. Like my video guy, we have a full-time graphic designer. She’s in Serbia. We’ve got people all over the place.

I know early on I didn’t really know . . . you kind of think, well, it’s inexpensive labor and you’re not really thinking about how to make them more productive necessarily, but you know, it’s systems and processes. You start to create, “This is how we do this. These are the 20 things you need to do.” Then you have to kind of figure it out and then you can hand it off to somebody. So can you maybe share your process a little bit there?

Jessica: For me, and it actually started eight years ago when I was introduced to the virtual assistant mentality. Anything I’ve done moving forward, I’m like, if it’s something I do repetitive, I need to put it down so that somebody else can do it. I actually do written procedures, but I also use different Screencast-O-Matic or whatever to actually do the task on my computer, record it so that the VAs can rewind and re-watch and ask me any questions. They’re usually just like a go, it’s not even any questions. It’s so put together for them and [inaudible 00:24:37].

Mike: It’s like an operating manual. You just say, “This is exactly how you do it and if you have any questions, let me know.”

Jessica: It is and it’s easy to add stuff. If I know they may be slow on something, I can quickly go through and add tasks for them or just have one-time tasks. Or if we need something done, working on a list or whatever, I can send it to them, but yeah, we use our VAs to help us with the large amount of offers that we’re submitting. We use them for marketing. We use them for cleaning up lists.

We use them for actually researching information and for probate stuff. It’s not a manual list that we buy. We actually get the records from the courthouse, so it’s a multistep process and they’re the ones completing the list for us on that.

Mike: That’s awesome.

Jessica: Then like we said, the realtor email and texts, they do that automatically.

Mike: Yeah. You start to get to a point to where you start thinking, “Well, what else can I have a virtual assistant do,” because once you kind of realize that, “Hey, if I show them the exact way and then I just say, ‘Do this every Tuesday,’ or on the first of each month” or whatever it is, something just pops at one point and you’re like, “Okay, what else can we do here.”

Jessica: It does.

Lee: That’s probably the hardest thing is to get people’s mindsets right in your business to understand that they can use these virtual assistants. They say, “Well, they can’t do that for you.” That’s the first thing you think.

Mike: Yeah, “I have to do that.”

Lee: “I have to do that.” We had a person when we first started using them, she actually left us because of the virtual assistants because she thought the virtual assistants couldn’t do it, were taking work off of her and she actually thought that they couldn’t do it. She left and now the virtual assistants have her position. It’s interesting on that part of it.

Jessica: Not everybody has that mentality from the get-go. It’s definitely the way I think [inaudible 00:26:36].

Mike: I think that stuff . . . because a lot of new real estate investors are . . . if you left your job or you’re trying to leave your job or whatever, you’re trying to be lean and mean and what ends up happening is you do everything yourself and then you start to think, “Well, nobody else can do that. I’m the only one that knows how to do it,” because it’s all in your head, which is true, but you just have to start documenting it like, “First I do this, then you do this.” Then that becomes a way to show other people how to do it. Then you can put some checks and balances in place like, “Prove to me that you did it.” Over time you build that trust up.

Jessica: Right.

Mike: What advice would you give for people that are trying to start using virtual systems for their business?

Lee: Like she said, you have to determine what you’re doing and then use the virtual assistants to replace what you’re doing.

Jessica: Someone has to have a clear understanding of the task and be able to perform the task in order to teach it. So you do have to understand what it is that you’re trying to teach them at first. But it’s super easy to record you doing the task and talk though it, answering questions as you walk on in short, five-minute increments, and then write out the procedures also.

My advice would be start . . . we started with a virtual assistant half-time, so 20 hours a week, so it’s not a huge financial investment on a monthly basis. You can start them off slow and as you build trust with them, hand more things off to them and increase them to full time and go from there.

Lee: It doesn’t take long. I think we had one 20-hours for a week before we put him full-time. Once you do those 20 hours, you’re going to use a virtual assistant.

Jessica: Whenever we hire one I always start them half-time to give me time to train them because I don’t need them a full eight hours when I’m training them for the first week. But I usually do when I’m hiring, one, let her know I’m going to need them to be full-time, but if they can just start off for the first couple weeks half-time.

Mike: Yeah, so you kind of ease into it. One thing that I know people . . . is good, this isn’t necessarily what I’ve done but it’s kind of, I think, good advice is to look at what you’re doing, all the things you’re doing right now and start to put your tasks into buckets, like what am I doing that’s a $5 or $10-an-hour job and what am I doing that’s a $1,000-an-hour job? And start to get the stuff that’s effectively below your pay grade or the stuff you hate doing and start to find ways to kind of create processes for somebody else to do that.

Jessica: That’s very true.

Lee: That’s the thing, the stuff you hate doing, you can get rid of and get it off your plate and do what you like to do.

Jessica: The one thing we haven’t outsourced to the VA, and I know it’s possible, I haven’t found that trust to give it up yet, is to evaluate the properties to determine what we offer the properties. I know it’s possible and I can create that system but I haven’t quite . . . there’s an instinct to it.

Mike: Yeah, there’s some gut feel stuff there for sure.

Jessica: So we’re not quite there but I know it’s got to be in the future if we want to continue to grow.

Mike: Yeah. Sometimes when we have a show . . . when I say people on the show are always interested in listeners contacting them to do deals or find ways to work together, but usually they’re in one small market, but you guys are in three states. I know you guys do a lot of partnering with people and things like that. If there’s somebody that’s in . . . So you’re in Georgia, you’re in Florida, and you’re in Alabama. Is that right?

Lee: Georgia, South Carolina and Alabama. Not too much in Florida.

Jessica: I live in Florida, but I don’t do much [inaudible 00:30:25].

Lee: Most of our business is Georgia, South Carolina, and Alabama.

Mike: Yeah. So if folks are interested in getting ahold of you guys and either buying houses from you or selling houses to you or whatever, where can they go to find you?

Lee: They can go to our website, www.southeasternproperties.com and they can reach us through that. We’re always looking for deals or partnerships and we do a lot of partnerships with a lot of different people, obviously, in a lot of markets.

Mike: Tell us that web address one more time, Lee.

Lee: Sorry.

Jessica: It’s www.southeasternrealestatesolutions.com.

Lee: So many different ones.

Mike: Hey, I understand. Okay. We’ll get a link down below the notes here for anybody that’s interested. I really appreciate you guys joining us today.

Lee: Thank you.

Jessica: Thanks.

Mike: I’ll see you guys, I guess, at our Mastermind here in . . .

Lee: March.

Mike: One more month, yeah, a few weeks out.

Lee: Yep, looking forward to it.

Jessica: Looking forward to it.

Mike: Great to see you guys. And everybody that joined us today, thanks for joining us with Lee and Jessica. Really appreciate you and we’ll see you on another upcoming episode.

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