Hey everybody, welcome back to the show! Today, we’ll talk about scaling your business! In Investor Fuel, it’s something that we talk a lot about with our members… how to move from the box of “the business owning you” to “you owning a business”. Matt Bell has been in this business for a while and is sharing his journey to owning a business.

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Mike: Hey, everybody, welcome back to the show. Today, we are going to be talking about scaling your business, something that at Investor Fuel that we talk a lot about with our members is how to kind of move from the box of the business owning you to you owning a business. And there are a few people that have a perspective that they could share with you that you’re going to get as much value out of today, as my buddy Matt Bell.
Professional real estate investors know that it’s not really about the real estate. In fact, real estate is just a vehicle to freedom. A group of over 100 of the nation’s leading real estate investors from across the country meet several times a year at the Investor Fuel Real Estate Mastermind to share ideas on how to strengthen each other’s businesses, but also to come together as friends and build more fulfilling lives for all of those around us. On today’s show, we’re going to continue our conversation of fueling our businesses and fueling our lives. I’m glad you’re here.
Matt: Hey, Mike, thanks, man.
Mike: Matt. Matt, welcome to the show. How’s it going?
Matt: Great. Great. How’s your day?
Mike: Good, good. So I’m excited to talk to you today because, you know, we’ve been friends for a number of years now and I’ve seen you guys pivot in your business a number of times, and at one point, did much more unit volume than you do today and pulled back because it just wasn’t as profitable or it didn’t fit. But that’s a lot of what we’re going to talk about today is it’s not all about necessarily doing more volume, it’s about building a business that’s more kind of sound, right?
Matt: Absolutely. Yeah, it’s iterative, you know? And we definitely have pushed up to the line, failed in a few different directions and have pivoted and tighten it down. And, you know, that’s kind of what it’s all about is learning as you go and failing forward.
Mike: Yeah. Yeah, we’ve all seen those memes of like, what some people that think successes is like a straight line, right, and then instead, it looks like kind of spaghetti. It’s like a bunch of up and down and you’re kind of failing your way forward. And that’s what we’re going to talk about today and specifically around your business and lessons learned. And so before we jump into that, if folks don’t know you, why don’t you share a little bit about your background and how you even got started in real estate investing?
Matt: Sure, yeah. So I got started in the back end of 2012, moved to Augusta, Georgia on a wing and a prayer, worked with one of my best friends Tyson Schuetze, he owns a turnkey brokerage there. I was going to learn the game and then go back to [inaudible 00:02:35] and then figured out that it’s pretty nice to be all in at 35k renting an $800 a month, right, like 20%, 25% yield, were still out there.
Anyways, so I just decided to stay. We had a definite synergy. And probably about eight months into the game, thankfully, I was fluent at that point, in walked a big fund, based out of Charleston and so I initially started working with them as a buyer’s agent and Tyson was functioning as a property manager, and we started consulting for them, and opening up new markets. I tried to give them some of their time back, you know, add value. And then they ultimately asked us to come to Charleston and take over the renovation division because they were starting to scale, right? And so they had the capital acquisition [was easier 00:03:26] to figure out. So, their acquisition was going like this, and their renovation was doing this, and that gulf was getting larger and they just legitimately were like, “Here’s the keys. Fix it, right?”
So anyway, you know, over a four-year period, we renovated just over 5500 homes. We were in 17 cities and 11 states, and so I’ve scaled a lot of businesses underneath that umbrella. And then everybody knows Brother Barnes, Brandon Barnes, who runs Home Buyers Network, which is now rebranded as INI Home Buyers. We started that business about three years ago. And originally, to your point a minute ago, it was originally built to be a feeder for the fund.
Mike: Right.
Matt: And about a year and a half ago, we kind of had a hard reset. I left the fund. Brandon was like, “This isn’t working.” And yeah, so we decided to build a business that had more than one client, right, and kind of reprioritized them as a buyer. They still have a place, but their batting last at this point, right, because there’s a lot [inaudible 00:04:33] dealing with funds. Anyway, so here we are.
Mike: Yeah, yeah. So, you know, one of the things that you’ve probably realized when you left the fund and you’re out on your own now, and the one of the things that we all . . . we talk a lot about, obviously. At Investor Fuel and as all business owners, we talk about or think about is, you know, if you think back about Robert Kiyosaki’s kind of Cashflow Quad, his quadrants, there’s like the upper left is you have a job, right, work for somebody else, then the next transition is people are self-employed.
Matt: Solopreneur.
Mike: They’re doing . . . you’re solopreneur or small business, you’re doing everything. And then the next box up is that you own a business and you have employees and resources and stuff and you’re able to leverage that. And so of course, then the last quadrant is you do nothing and your money is just working for you. So it’s like we all want to move through that quadrant, right? And so one of the things that I think often about is that a lot of times in Investor Fuel, our Gold Group members tend to be in that lower left quadrant. They’re solopreneurs, they’re a husband and wife teams or small teams, and they’re still working harder than they want to in the day-to-day. The Platinum Group is more the next level, which is people that own a business and they have employees. And you can see it when we’re there. Like, a lot of the Gold Members are running out, they got to make a call, or they got to do something. The Platinum members are like, “Hey, my team’s on it,” right, more often than not.
Matt: Yeah.
Mike: I’m sure you whole team’s there, like, you guys were last week. But anyway, what I want to talk about today, I think what people will get a lot of value out of is how to move from a business owning you, right, being self-employed solopreneur, small entrepreneur, to you owning a business, and you guys have a lot of lessons learned by doing that, right? So kind of share your thoughts on, or maybe even kind of share a little bit of your story about kind of moving through those quadrants.
Matt:So my original experience was not really with HBN. You know, my original experience with [contracts 00:06:28] the fund. And so it was always my job to meet the pace of acquisition, right? So if we’re buying 30 a month in a city, we need to be renovating 30 a month, or if we’re buying 10 or whatever. And it always ebb and flow, which was hard to pivot, you know? So kind of the concept of capacity was born and staying in the highest and best use of your time. We helped scale businesses there first and foremost prior to, you know, getting into the HBN world. And, you know, what works, we were talking about earlier, what works at five homes a month does not work at 15 homes a month and what works 15 does not work at 30, and it’s okay to fail, you’re always going to hit capacity.
And the challenge for me in the world of renovation, which was my original experience was, say a guy is doing five a month and wants to do seven, right, you win, they win if you’ve aligned yourself directly. When you pass that capacity mark, it’s not just the two that you’re above capacity that fail, it’s all seven, right? As an example.
Mike: Right.
Matt: And so you have to be very real-time aware that, “Oh, my gosh. I’ve hit that breaking point.” And really try to freeze frame, slow it down, mitigate the damage that is occurring, and implement new systems and tighten it down to where you can push back up. I mean, it’s iterative. You’re going to constantly fail and I think, you know, you have to be okay with that.
Mike: Yeah, yeah, there’s a lot of, you know, I’d say most real estate investors. So first off, most real estate investors fail before they get started, right? Your next kind of breaking point is when you hit your own personal capacity, right? So like you said, whether it’s five deals, it depends on if you’re wholesaling, or rehabbing, or whatever. But once you get to the point to where you don’t have capacity to scale, that’s where things break down, right? It’s like some people are like, I mean, this is like, most small businesses, right, the owner really is self-employed, they’re still doing a lot of the things. So to get to that next level, you’ve got to have systems, you’ve got to have people in place.
Matt: But before that, Mike, you have to know where to put those systems and people, right?
Mike: Right.
Matt: Like at Fuel, we’re talking, I can’t remember who was up, but we were talking last week, somebody who’s struggling with this exact topic, and everybody immediately went into solution mode, right, because we’re always wanting to help. I suggested that we take a step before that first. Before you even know what the solutions are, you’ve got to know where you’re spending your time. So I tell people, to your point, that’s a finite quantity, you only have so much time. And so, to your point, when you are busier than you have the time to do all those things with, then you’ve got to start making choices between, you know, the myriad of things that you’re trying to do the highest and best use of time.
So my first step was, and I would do this with the renovation managers, is first step before you start putting in systems . . . you don’t even know where to put them in, right? You don’t know where to hire, like, track your time. I think when most people do that for like a two-week period, every hour, “What did I just do?” Like, and when you go back and look at it, most people are floored by where they’re spending the most time.
Mike: Yeah.
Matt: Really easy to see that, “Hey, I spend six hours on administrative things per day or, you know, whatever the numbers are, “Oh, my gosh. Like, what an incredible waste of time, right?” What’s your time worth? Would you pay some . . . so my time is worth, I’m making numbers up, by my time is worth, let’s say, $200 an hour, right? Would I pay somebody $200 an hour to tie up the books? Would I pay somebody $200 an hour to, you know, do lead intake? No, right? And so if you think about it from that perspective, it’s a lot easier. Once you know where your time is going, then it’s easier to say, “Hey, that’s not the highest and best use of my time. I need to [leverage 00:10:39].”
Mike: Yeah. And to complicate it further, as you kind of grow in your business, or you’re growing your life or your business maturity, then it’s not just a matter of, “What’s the highest and best use of your time.” It’s like what brings you the most or least amount of joy, too?
Mike: Joy?
Matt: Yeah, I mean, really, we all want to live this better lifestyle, and sometimes you look back. And there’s things that I’ve done that I’m like, “Wow, on A P&L that looks good. It looks like it’s great.” But like, I really hate it. Like, I don’t like doing that anymore. And so, you know, at the end of the day, in your business, when you get to a point to where everything you do isn’t about money necessarily anymore, it’s like, “Do I like that? Do I even like that?” You know, it complicates everything, right? But, of course, it’s important because none of us need to be doing this if we don’t find joy in it.
Mike: Sure.
Matt: Well, so we talked about that last week, too, right? And I mean, when I say highest and best, I mean, passion, right? Passion.
Mike: Right. Right. Right.
Matt: Yeah. Because you’re never going to achieve at the highest level unless it’s both something that you’re really good at, and something you really enjoy. It’s like, you’re going to bump your chin every day on something, and you’ve got to be able to pick yourself up and overcome it. If you’re literally doing that kind of like soul sucking activity that you hate every day, you’re going to die on the vine, right? That’s not . . . it’s not scalable, right?
Mike: Yeah, yeah. So let’s talk a little bit about . . . there’s kind of two thoughts on . . . well, I’m making up a framework here, but kind of two thoughts on growth. You either like, try to plan out everything that you’ll need, or there’s like, just go do it and fail, and figure out what didn’t work and build from there. And I know that you are cut from the cloth on that latter phase. And I believe that, too. There’s no way to go figure out everything we have to do. I mean, you should plan. I’m not saying you shouldn’t try to be wise about it, but you could never academically plan what we do in our business, and account for all the things that will go wrong without them actually happening to you, right? So share your thoughts on that, specifically to how you guys have grown your business so far.
Matt: Yeah, I mean, not to be too abstract here, but it’s almost like trying to plan at a certain point without the experience, there’s only so far you can go, right? So it’d be like me trying to explain to somebody or somebody explaining to what it’s like to be a dad, right? There’s only so much understanding that I’m going to have on that until I actually experience it, right? So, from the same perspective, I can tell somebody what it’s like to do 20 houses a month. But until you get there, you really don’t know what you’re going to need to succeed there. So we look at it very much . . . we try to be unemotional about it and understand that we’re going to fail forward through it.
I mean, as it relates to Brandon and our operating business, a lot of it is understanding that we’re going to have to make decisions as we go. So, yes, we want to be thoughtful whenever we’re trying something new, because we want to mitigate the amount of pain that we’re going to go through. But at a certain point, you just, you know, paralysis by analysis, right? There’s only so much I can prepare for before I need to take that first step because, you know, I don’t know what the room looks like from that perspective, so that’s how we approach it. It’s just [inaudible 00:14:05].
Mike: Yeah. And I think for experienced investors, there’s like a business maturity thing where you have to get comfortable with the unknown, you have to get comfortable that some shit is going to break and that’s okay, and I’ll deal with it, instead of like, “How do I prevent anything from breaking?” It’s like everything. You can’t learn unless you fail. You’ve got to be able to fail forward, you got to be okay with . . . you know, I deal with a lot of new, like, coaching students and stuff like that, and so many people are afraid. They’re like they got to figure it all out before they go. It’s like, “Just go. If you fail, it’s cool.” That’s just not how the real world works, right?
Matt: Right. Yeah, they never take a step. I mean, again, to be a successful entrepreneur at your core, you have to take massive action, and not fear the consequences. I mean, you have to be thoughtful and you don’t want to make a catastrophic mistake, of course, but take massive action, fail massively, right? I always tell Brandon, “My job for that company really is to be the bumper on the on the bowling lane, right?” Like, “I know, you guys are going to be just bouncing off the bumpers all the way down, but I need to know if we’re going in the gutter so I can jump in and help, right?” Because I really don’t function in the business very much. And as you saw, I can’t remember if it was you or Stinson in that room, or maybe both, but Brandon had his ask, and I’m like, “I’ve got that Stinson smile.”
Mike: Oh, yeah, yeah.
Matt:I was like, “Do you guys know each other, you know?” But that’s because we’re so busy and so driven and we run, you know, in our own directions. A lot of times, we just . . . and it’s a communication thing, which is actually another big part of the scaling conversation is the bigger and the faster it moves, the more that communication has to be executed. I mean, that’s absurd that Brandon had to ask of, like, whatever, it was a property management, you know, operations manual. And I’m like, “I’ve got one, right?” It’s absurd. We work together all the time. And that’s a failure on my part.
Mike: Yeah. And those things happen, right? I mean, that’s just how it works. But talk a little bit about for your business. I mean, you’ve chosen to be less involved in the day-to-day operation. And Brandon Barnes, for those of you that don’t know, Brandon’s a great guy. We’ll add a link to some shows he’s been on in the past. And he’s more the CEO and involved in the day-to-day stuff. I mean, by design you guys not that you haven’t had problems, and we just talked about that, of course, you’re going to have problems.
Matt: Yeah.
Mike: But by design, you guys have built this from the beginning to kind of scale and to have a team that fits, at least for you, that kind of fits the lifestyle that you want to live, it gives you the freedom to do other things that you want to do, too, right? Let’s put it in perspective. With a lot of other real estate investors. they start in that employee, go to self-employed, they kind of like are trying to go through each step. And in many ways, you just said, “I’m going to skip that step, right, and I’m going to put plug a team in place that’s going to handle that.”
Matt: Yeah. Well, I mean, it’s good and bad, right? And the jury is still out on whether it’s going to work officially at the scale that we want. I think it will, we’re failing forward as we go like any business. But, yeah, I’ve always functioned kind of in a consultant role outside for kind of more institutional level companies. And when I left the fund, we had about a 10-month period where I was in the office, and I’m high DIC, so I’m like, “That’s broken. What’s wrong with this? That’s massively inefficient, right?” And then I’m taking massive action that was really uncomfortable for Brandon and frankly, for me, too. It’s really hard to have two visionaries, you know, in the same space. And so I made a conscious decision to step back and to let him drive, which is hard for me, and it’s hard for a lot of people, which is why they don’t, right? It’s a control thing.
Mike: Right. Right.
Matt: And so it’s not to say that it’s been easy. But you’re right, I have been very purposeful in choosing to try to build this thing together, where I can consult with Brandon in that business, but not actually be the person driving the vehicle.
Mike: Yeah. Yeah. And you guys have effectively a CEO now in Joe. What advice can you give to people to, I guess, think about the bigger picture and plug the right people in place? A lot of people kind of grow their way into it, or they do it by default. Like, “I’m going to plug somebody in when I need them.” But you guys have had probably the vision, unlike most people do to say, you know, “let’s assume we’re five years in the future and we’re big and we have a team. Like, let’s start to put the people in place in advance, otherwise, we can’t get there, right?” Any thoughts or kind of words of wisdom you could share with people to kind of build a team out in advance of necessarily needing them and then filling in as you go?
Matt: Yeah, man. I think, you know, a lot of it has to do with network, a lot of it has to do with funnel, just like you do with any part of the business. Always want to have . . . because your sphere of influence is really where you can impact of business most. And, you know, the fact that I can call anybody in Fuel at any given point and know that I can talk to an expert in, you know, lead gen, CRM, and mailers and, you know, acquisition, disposition, so we leverage that a lot.
And I feel like, we’re focused on failing forward and you’re never ever, ever going to, and to your point, you don’t want to hire when you have the need, you want to be ahead of it. But you’re still not ever going to know if it’s the right person, ultimately, until the rubber meets the road. And so not letting that and what is it? Hire slowly, fire quickly, right? I mean, I just want to be thoughtful in the approach. But ultimately, I want to align my interest with people like Brandon and Joe, where if they win, I win. Then all I ever have to worry about is helping them, right? And I think Brandon in very much the same way has taken that approach with Joe, and that’s part of our culture.
Mike: Yeah. Yeah. And some people learn that over a long period of time, and some people learn it quicker. I would say I learned that over a long period of time. But part of it is, you know, being a part of a mastermind, like, Investor Fuel or being around other people, like, the wisdom curve is much shorter because you’re around so many people that have learned those lessons before you, right?
Matt: Yeah, I mean, none of us need to reinvent the wheel. I mean, somebody has failed in every single direction. If I can find those people and, you know, utilize the bumps and bruises that they’ve experienced ahead of time, yeah, it’s just going to lessen, then I can fail forward in ways that are truly needed in our development versus things that I could have avoided, right?
Mike: Right. Yeah. Maybe share your thoughts on, like you said, when you guys started, you were feeding the hedge fund, and it was very transactional, right? You were going deal to deal to deal deals fast, many deals as you possibly can. And then you realized, “Hey, we can make more money by doing other things with them.” And I know, over the past, you know, six months or a year, you guys have realized that, “Hey, we need to be keeping some of those for ourselves.” And truthfully, that’s a common thing for all real estate investors to get to a point where you look back and you’re like, “I have some rentals, or I have a portfolio.” You’re like, “Man, I wish it was like 10X the size, like, where I wish I would have kept more. I mean, I think that all the time. And you guys are kind of moving the path of keeping more assets for yourself because it’s another revenue stream that someday you won’t have to be as transactional, right? So maybe share your thoughts on what you’ve learned so far around that?
Matt: Yeah, I mean, I think it’s diversification kind of eases the ebb and flow, right? And so we want to wholesaling is quicker, transactional, right. But usually not as big as a financial gain as a good retail flip might be, so we want to have a little bit of everything going on. And to your point, the cash flow, the steady income, eliminates or mitigates the ebb and flow even that much more. So it’s more of just a diversification where we can press or pull whatever lever at whatever time. So once I have all these channels built out, or bolt-ons, or whatever you want to call it, then I can truly make an asset-by-asset decision, or a cash flow decision depending on where we are in the business at any given time. So like if we need to capitalize quickly, like a need to wholesale this with return. If it’s we’re okay, we’re steady right now, let’s try to make a big lick or two, right? I mean, that it just I want to have the ability to press whatever button that I need to press at any given time and having that flexibility, which you don’t have if you’re a one-trick pony.
Mike: Yeah, no doubt, no doubt. Cool. So you’re obviously doing some lending now, as well. Maybe talk a little bit about your lessons learned on your . . . maybe you can explain what you’re doing with lending. But just, you know, you have a different view on the importance of lending or where that’s going industry wide. Maybe kind of share your thoughts there.
Matt: Yeah, so I think leverage is critical. I mean, your returns increase when you understand how to use leverage. I think that you have to do it responsibly and I think it’s an individually, you know, kind of determined decision from the risk tolerance level, right? I know, guys that are cash and cash only, I know guys that are leveraged to the hilt, and I’m probably somewhere in the middle.
Mike: Yeah.
Matt: Yeah, we not only are doing some lending, but we’re engaging in borrowing as well. And so it’s just kind of a . . . it’s a channel, right? So I’m consulting for LendingHome, which we’ve talked about, and so that’s an interesting world. It’s a fix and flip product, and it fits in certain states and certain types of deals. I’m trying to build out very much the same thing that we’re talking about with the business bolt-on perspective where I know I have to call right now Lending One, right? If I if I have a rental portfolio that I need to refinance, or whatever that may be, or a local bank or whatever, we’re just starting to build our three-ring bank binder where I know who to call and when, and so it’s a process.
We’re definitely not in a position where we know and have those built out relationships. I mean, if I could get a straight 15 or a straight 30 on a rental, I’d do that every time, right? But unfortunately, you’ve got to find those people and finding those . . . and frankly, you need to find them, but you usually have to kind of graduate to that within that relationship. And anyway, so we’re just kind of in process of understanding the lending world and hopefully, we get to quadrant four, you know? That’s the [inaudible 00:25:37] the point.
Mike: Yeah, exactly. It’s interesting, because at the time, we’re recording this, the stock market took a big hit yesterday, and I started to see all this stuff in social media, like, the real estate market is going to collapse or whatever. You know, people start saying stuff. And I don’t know when the market is going to shift. But I wouldn’t be surprised if did here soon, right? or maybe it’s a little ways out. I mean, truthfully, I thought it would happen a few years ago, if you would have asked me five or six years ago. It’s just, you know, it’s pretty resilient, or it’s obviously propped up by cheap money and all those things.
But it really is important for people to have a lot of those . . . I mean, if you have not spent the last few years building lending relationships. Because like you said, everybody has different products, everybody has different risk tolerance, and all those things are going to get thrown out the window or shift if the market shifts, right, because the underlying finance is going to change. And so maybe kind of share your thoughts on just kind of what you would advise people to do to be prepared for a shift in the market in terms of lending and lending relationships.
Matt: I mean, you have to spend time and effort and energy there first. I think you have to be thoughtful about, you know, your capital position, cash flow position at any given point. So, you know, I hear a lot of people right now, where they’re just they’re selling off assets, they want to be kind of cash rich as opposed to asset rich. You know, just in case, I think that’s a little bit of a scarcity mindset. I think that’s a little overboard.
But yeah, I want to be instead of being 75% LTV on everything, maybe we’re at 50%, right, on per asset basis. If I’m used to carrying 40 grand in my checking account, or whatever that number is, maybe it’s $75,000 right now. So there’s some hedges. But that’s what we do in all walks of business. I mean, I just want to hedge so I can absorb any kind of shift and not make it catastrophic. Again, it’s that [inaudible 00:27:39] mentality. I just don’t want to make a catastrophic mistake and so I’m trying to protect myself in every direction that I can.
Mike: Yeah, for sure.
Matt: [Inaudible 00:27:48] silver bullet, right. And it is an individual thing. But the more relationships you have in that world, I think the better. The more options you have, lending products you have access to, etc., I think that only broadens your ability to take a hit from whatever direction that might come from, which is always unknown.
Mike: Right, right. Yeah, I would just advise people like, you know, what happens in a downturn is some people run away. And the wise investors, the people that have been through this before, are the ones that are prepared know that all that’s happening is there’s a sale that’s going on, and that it’s time to stock up, right? And so the more you can be prepared financially with lenders, and people that understand that . . . some people stop lending. Like, let’s say the small individual guy is using his own money, like, he may just stop lending, right?
Matt: Right. Yeah.
Mike: LendingHome and big lenders like that, they’re going to change their criteria, but they’re not going to stop lending. What they’re going to shift to is people they have a strongest relationships with, and those that have the most proven track record, maybe just because that’s less risk for them, right? But as real estate investors listening to this, just know that when the sale comes, it’s time to go shopping. And you don’t want to find out that your credit card limit is maxed out already.
Matt: I’m contrarian about it. Very much to what you’re, you know, alluding to is the people that are capitalized, when the downturn occurs, can take advantage of the downturn. Whatever that downturn looks like, they’re in a better position than the people who are not. So and I tell Brandon, and Joe, and everybody on our team, this and anybody who asks, frankly, what do you think? Is it going to shift? And, you know, what’s going to happen? Like, I hope it does. You know, to be perfectly frank, if we’re executing at the top of the market, then when it shifts, we’re going gangbusters. Like, I look forward to it, frankly. So, you know, a little bit of a contrarian perspective.
Mike: Yeah, absolutely. No, I agree with you. I agree with you. And that’s my, you know, when I look back to the last cycle, it’s like, I wasn’t . . . you know, I started in ’08, so I wasn’t fully aware. I kind of came in when the shit was hitting the fan, proverbially, but I’ve learned enough over the last 11-plus years to know that when that day comes, that’s when the biggest opportunities come. So it doesn’t mean you can’t operate in any market, but those that are most prepared for when that shift occurs, that’s where the real money is made.
Matt: A hundred percent. I agree completely.
Mike: Yeah. So Matt, you’ve been in Investor Fuel, between you and Brandon, you guys have been members from day one, actually, almost two years now. I appreciate that. So maybe share a testimonial on your thoughts on the Investor Field Mastermind?
Matt: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, it’s bar none, one of the best groups that I’ve ever participated in. I’ve got some experience in the space on the mastermind side of the world. And it’s unparalleled, the passion, the talent, the wisdom. I mean, talk about learning from others’ mistakes, I mean, it’s definitely, people are extremely transparent, and are willing to help, they have a mentality of abundance, they’re not afraid to share trade secrets, or whatever else. It’s refreshing. And there’s always tons of value, man, every single time I go.
And this is what I tell people when they ask me about Investor Fuel, right, and it’s totally unprompted for those that are watching. It’s not that Mike told me to say this thing. Like, if you can’t 10X your investment, attending one meeting, then you’re not trying, right? Like, literally there’s that much value there. So yeah, I mean, I encourage anybody and everybody, if you’re that type of personality who is willing to give first, you’ll receive 10X. I mean, it’s just the way that you’ve built that framework and that culture. It’s been great, man, since day one.
Mike: Awesome, thank you. I appreciate you guys. And I agree, right? Like, we very much put forth, right or wrong, I won’t say it was all by design, we built this culture around sharing and giving and being vulnerable. And like at the end of the day, this is how I think about it, we’re all business owners. It doesn’t have to be a chest thumping exercise. We’re all going through some crap. There’s always bad parts of the business. Like, let’s not pretend.
It’s not like social media, like, let’s just show the good stuff. Like, let’s talk about the bad stuff because, just like we talk about this whole show, those failures, those mistakes, those errors are the best learning opportunities we have. And if we share them as a group, we can all learn even faster and avoid those mistakes in the future. I mean, who wouldn’t rather learn from other people’s mistakes than having to necessarily do it on your own, you know? Not that those aren’t the best lessons to learn on your own, but if you can avoid them completely, like, why not?
Matt: No-brainer, man. It’s been great since day one. Really, you guys have done a fantastic job. It’s a great group.
Mike: Thanks, Matt. So for folks that want to learn more about what you’re doing, you got all sorts of stuff going on, where can they go to learn more to connect with you?
Matt: Yeah, so Brandon and I, obviously, we have the INI Home Buyers page. We buy and sell a couple hundred deals a year. You know, we love to connect with people. We’re always looking to help in any way we can. As I mentioned earlier, I’m working with LendingHome right now. Happy to help anybody out with fix and flip lending. They have some of the best products that we ever found as an operator. I mean, I’m happy to give my cell phone if that’s appropriate, or my email, if that’s appropriate, you know? Cell phone 706-267-3293. I’m always available. If I miss you, I’ll ping you back. Always ready and willing to help. And then my email is [email protected] if, you know, you want to ping me there.
Mike: Awesome. Appreciate that. Hey, thanks for sharing your lessons learned and your time with us today.
Matt: Yeah, Mike, thank you for having me, man. I always enjoy connecting.
Mike: Yeah, yeah, we talk awesome. I always enjoy talking to you because the wheels are always turning when we get together.
Matt: Dangerously so. Yeah.
Mike: Yeah, exactly, exactly.
So, everybody, thanks for joining us today on the show. As you know, the Investor Fuel show is relatively new, still, bringing you great guests and great information each and every week. If you haven’t yet, we’d love it if you’d subscribe and give us a positive review on Stitcher, iTunes, Google Play, YouTube anywhere where you might check us out. And, of course, you can find all of our shows by visiting investorfuel.com. Until next time, everybody, see on the next show.
Are you an active real estate investor? If so and you want to latch on to the power of surrounding yourself with over 100 of the nation’s leading real estate investors all committed to building stronger businesses and living richer, fuller lives, you should jump on a call with us to learn more about Investor Fuel. Simply visit investorfuel.com to get started.

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